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	<title>Comments on: Of Google and Page Speed</title>
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	<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/</link>
	<description>Web design news and insights since 1995</description>
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		<title>By: Pjman</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54858</link>
		<dc:creator>Pjman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 May 2010 23:44:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54858</guid>
		<description>I definitely felt this slap from Google.  After it went live my rankings tanked across the board.  It took me 6 weeks to figure out.  I  cut my template size in half and now my rankings are climbing back up.   It was slow on the webmaster tools graph. Now it touches the fast rating on the google graph.  No content or link changes, only reduced template size and image size.  I have head of about 6 other people having the same issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I definitely felt this slap from Google.  After it went live my rankings tanked across the board.  It took me 6 weeks to figure out.  I  cut my template size in half and now my rankings are climbing back up.   It was slow on the webmaster tools graph. Now it touches the fast rating on the google graph.  No content or link changes, only reduced template size and image size.  I have head of about 6 other people having the same issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Tiger Koehn</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54643</link>
		<dc:creator>Tiger Koehn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Apr 2010 17:38:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54643</guid>
		<description>I have to honest. This is the most ridiculous debate. Being a web designer/developer and a professional musician I find the majority of the websites out there extremely boring and mediocre. Most follow the same bland uninteresting formats and visually they are pretty pathetic. Understanding how Enterprise sites must be what they are, small corp sites  must follow what their customers want, etc: However, in the music industry and visual arts industry we WANT sites that are pleasing to the eye AND interactive. The sites are rich in photographic content, musical content and now video content. If the site takes 2 to 3 seconds to load with a preloader....who cares??..Usually and I repeat, Usually the sites are beautiful, full of vibrant content and even exciting at times. We in this industry, music and film, fashion, art....don&#039;t want to read pages and page of some clowns sudo-witty drab. We want to celebrate our creations and others creations....like music, art, photography, film and personal galleries.   I read a lot of books so do not find it necessary to read pages and pages of other peoples opinions. The web for me and hundreds of thousands of people in the performing arts world are there to look at beautifully created websites and their contents. Yuppies over there and Artists over here. We should not be penalized for content. Have a little patience for Gods sake. Google should be &quot;Bitch-Slapped&quot;.If 3 to 4 seconds is to long for you to wait as the preloader loads a content rich site, well...........there&#039;s something very wrong with you</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to honest. This is the most ridiculous debate. Being a web designer/developer and a professional musician I find the majority of the websites out there extremely boring and mediocre. Most follow the same bland uninteresting formats and visually they are pretty pathetic. Understanding how Enterprise sites must be what they are, small corp sites  must follow what their customers want, etc: However, in the music industry and visual arts industry we WANT sites that are pleasing to the eye AND interactive. The sites are rich in photographic content, musical content and now video content. If the site takes 2 to 3 seconds to load with a preloader&#8230;.who cares??..Usually and I repeat, Usually the sites are beautiful, full of vibrant content and even exciting at times. We in this industry, music and film, fashion, art&#8230;.don&#8217;t want to read pages and page of some clowns sudo-witty drab. We want to celebrate our creations and others creations&#8230;.like music, art, photography, film and personal galleries.   I read a lot of books so do not find it necessary to read pages and pages of other peoples opinions. The web for me and hundreds of thousands of people in the performing arts world are there to look at beautifully created websites and their contents. Yuppies over there and Artists over here. We should not be penalized for content. Have a little patience for Gods sake. Google should be &#8220;Bitch-Slapped&#8221;.If 3 to 4 seconds is to long for you to wait as the preloader loads a content rich site, well&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;..there&#8217;s something very wrong with you</p>
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		<title>By: Dayne</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54285</link>
		<dc:creator>Dayne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Apr 2010 19:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54285</guid>
		<description>This is great news for everyone. Every time Google makes a big change, the internet gets a little bit better!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is great news for everyone. Every time Google makes a big change, the internet gets a little bit better!</p>
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		<title>By: J Cornelius</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54249</link>
		<dc:creator>J Cornelius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Apr 2010 01:17:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54249</guid>
		<description>Ian and Jeff are 100% correct. This isn&#039;t about sites that may be a little slow. It should have zero impact on sites that are served with reasonable speed. It&#039;s about the behemoth sites served on slow connections.  

Has anyone considered that it may partially be marketing? Google knows the influence they hold over the web community. If they want to push the trend toward more optimized sites (which leads to a better experience for everyone)  announcing policies like this is a good way to do so. 

Also, by de-emphasizing slower sites I&#039;m sure they can save — or at least better utilize — precious CPU cycles when spidering sites as well. Even lowering the request time-out threshold by fractions of a second could lead to sizable efficiency gains. Then there is the bandwidth play Ron mentioned. 

Bottom line: Just continue to make clean, semantic, optimized sites. You&#039;ll be fine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ian and Jeff are 100% correct. This isn&#8217;t about sites that may be a little slow. It should have zero impact on sites that are served with reasonable speed. It&#8217;s about the behemoth sites served on slow connections.  </p>
<p>Has anyone considered that it may partially be marketing? Google knows the influence they hold over the web community. If they want to push the trend toward more optimized sites (which leads to a better experience for everyone)  announcing policies like this is a good way to do so. </p>
<p>Also, by de-emphasizing slower sites I&#8217;m sure they can save — or at least better utilize — precious CPU cycles when spidering sites as well. Even lowering the request time-out threshold by fractions of a second could lead to sizable efficiency gains. Then there is the bandwidth play Ron mentioned. </p>
<p>Bottom line: Just continue to make clean, semantic, optimized sites. You&#8217;ll be fine.</p>
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		<title>By: Ferdy</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54241</link>
		<dc:creator>Ferdy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 16:55:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54241</guid>
		<description>Designers and developers really should be re-educated about bandwidth and page speed, but not for the reason you mention. Page rank will not be affected for 99% of all sites, so the &quot;dilemma&quot; is not for the sake of SEO.

The real dilemma is because internet access is still spreading out to emerging countries with poor connections, and even to developed countries by increased mobile usage. On top of that, existing users expect snappy web pages, where before they&#039;d happily wait for this wonder the internet to load a page in a minute. Those three combined are the reasons speed matters, not this 1% SEO thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Designers and developers really should be re-educated about bandwidth and page speed, but not for the reason you mention. Page rank will not be affected for 99% of all sites, so the &#8220;dilemma&#8221; is not for the sake of SEO.</p>
<p>The real dilemma is because internet access is still spreading out to emerging countries with poor connections, and even to developed countries by increased mobile usage. On top of that, existing users expect snappy web pages, where before they&#8217;d happily wait for this wonder the internet to load a page in a minute. Those three combined are the reasons speed matters, not this 1% SEO thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Allan Davies</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54237</link>
		<dc:creator>Allan Davies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 14:40:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54237</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t believe a site should be ranked lower because it uses more images, I personally really like nice and sharp images. As long as sites are not penalized for having extravagant designs there will be no problems. To improve the efficiency of the internet as a whole is a great idea. The faster and more responsive websites are the better. Perhaps a move in this direction will stimulate growth of better technologies for loading beautiful websites faster.  I also like the idea that clients would require further SEO services on their sites that already exist, perhaps creating a few more clients for people like us.

Google&#039;s power over the internet does worry me though. We have seen how such power can hurt the internet [IE6].</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t believe a site should be ranked lower because it uses more images, I personally really like nice and sharp images. As long as sites are not penalized for having extravagant designs there will be no problems. To improve the efficiency of the internet as a whole is a great idea. The faster and more responsive websites are the better. Perhaps a move in this direction will stimulate growth of better technologies for loading beautiful websites faster.  I also like the idea that clients would require further SEO services on their sites that already exist, perhaps creating a few more clients for people like us.</p>
<p>Google&#8217;s power over the internet does worry me though. We have seen how such power can hurt the internet [IE6].</p>
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		<title>By: Brooks Grigson</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54234</link>
		<dc:creator>Brooks Grigson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 13:52:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54234</guid>
		<description>A sidebar would be to think about the data side of the house. I have found that Steve Sounders - http://stevesouders.com/ - explains the impacts of bloated websites and the issues from a data delivery perspective. You know the benefit of sprites one image that is 10k can render a page faster than bunch of tiny images individually. But this also has an impact on the server(s) that display content. Each request to the server requires the server to do something. Being smart can reduce server load. The other and more relevant point to this discussion is more pertinent to large sites serving lots of content. Consider the bandwidth savings, storage savings, power consumption, additional server clusters etc. No need for Nielsen like text only approaches, but being smart about imagery, JS, CSS etc and lead to efficient and fast sites.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A sidebar would be to think about the data side of the house. I have found that Steve Sounders &#8211; <a href="http://stevesouders.com/">http://stevesouders.com/</a> &#8211; explains the impacts of bloated websites and the issues from a data delivery perspective. You know the benefit of sprites one image that is 10k can render a page faster than bunch of tiny images individually. But this also has an impact on the server(s) that display content. Each request to the server requires the server to do something. Being smart can reduce server load. The other and more relevant point to this discussion is more pertinent to large sites serving lots of content. Consider the bandwidth savings, storage savings, power consumption, additional server clusters etc. No need for Nielsen like text only approaches, but being smart about imagery, JS, CSS etc and lead to efficient and fast sites.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54231</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 09:34:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54231</guid>
		<description>Fantastic.. something else I slap my web design students around the head with as they yet again ignore my plea to optimise images!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantastic.. something else I slap my web design students around the head with as they yet again ignore my plea to optimise images!</p>
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		<title>By: lemoose</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54230</link>
		<dc:creator>lemoose</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 08:08:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54230</guid>
		<description>That looks like a good example of a de facto monopoly forcing changes and decisions on a whole industry.
Basically Google think every web site on the planet should look lile their homepage?
;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That looks like a good example of a de facto monopoly forcing changes and decisions on a whole industry.<br />
Basically Google think every web site on the planet should look lile their homepage?<br />
;-)</p>
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		<title>By: Clive Walker</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54229</link>
		<dc:creator>Clive Walker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 07:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54229</guid>
		<description>Regarding &quot;of late we have grown fat&quot;, I think we all need to remember the statement (cannot remember who said this originally) that just because broadband is 10x faster, doesn&#039;t mean that an image (read website) should be 10x bigger; users expect 10x faster speed so the image (website) should be the same size.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding &#8220;of late we have grown fat&#8221;, I think we all need to remember the statement (cannot remember who said this originally) that just because broadband is 10x faster, doesn&#8217;t mean that an image (read website) should be 10x bigger; users expect 10x faster speed so the image (website) should be the same size.</p>
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		<title>By: Hercules Papatheodorou</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54228</link>
		<dc:creator>Hercules Papatheodorou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 07:42:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54228</guid>
		<description>Hm, that&#039;s been rumored for a while but it seems it&#039;s getting closer to reality.
Those of us using &lt;strong&gt;Google Webmaster Tools&lt;/strong&gt; will find a &lt;em&gt;Site performance&lt;/em&gt; option under &lt;em&gt;Labs&lt;/em&gt;. I discovered today that it now takes cachable, google-served JavaScript into account. GZIP seems to be in high esteem aswell.

The report is something along these lines:
&lt;blockquote&gt;On average, pages in your site take 3.2 seconds to load (updated on Apr 10, 2010). This is faster than 52% of sites. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

I&#039;d be very interested in how Google treats Flash and how about the case where there&#039;s a graceful fallback?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hm, that&#8217;s been rumored for a while but it seems it&#8217;s getting closer to reality.<br />
Those of us using <strong>Google Webmaster Tools</strong> will find a <em>Site performance</em> option under <em>Labs</em>. I discovered today that it now takes cachable, google-served JavaScript into account. GZIP seems to be in high esteem aswell.</p>
<p>The report is something along these lines:</p>
<blockquote><p>On average, pages in your site take 3.2 seconds to load (updated on Apr 10, 2010). This is faster than 52% of sites. </p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;d be very interested in how Google treats Flash and how about the case where there&#8217;s a graceful fallback?</p>
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		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54227</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 05:48:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54227</guid>
		<description>@SeanJA OK that was an overly simplistic example, that page wouldn&#039;t rank. But think of a progressively enhanced Flash page, with proper fall-back content (i.e. a HTML version of the site sitting underneath for non-Flash users).

The HTML version might be a perfect, standards-based, fast-loading HTML/CSS site, and this is what Google will see (and, I assume, use to measure a page&#039;s loading time). 

But the Flash version that is shown to most users might not be as fast-loading - it has all the bandwidth-heavy bells &amp; whistles required by a multinational&#039;s marketing department. The wrapper SWF that&#039;s actually embedded on the page can be tiny, but is used to load heavier content in. 

Will Google penalise a 50kB page with an embedded SWF that loads another 10MB of content, as opposed to a 300kb pure HTML/CSS/JS page? Hope so...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@SeanJA OK that was an overly simplistic example, that page wouldn&#8217;t rank. But think of a progressively enhanced Flash page, with proper fall-back content (i.e. a HTML version of the site sitting underneath for non-Flash users).</p>
<p>The HTML version might be a perfect, standards-based, fast-loading HTML/CSS site, and this is what Google will see (and, I assume, use to measure a page&#8217;s loading time). </p>
<p>But the Flash version that is shown to most users might not be as fast-loading &#8211; it has all the bandwidth-heavy bells &amp; whistles required by a multinational&#8217;s marketing department. The wrapper SWF that&#8217;s actually embedded on the page can be tiny, but is used to load heavier content in. </p>
<p>Will Google penalise a 50kB page with an embedded SWF that loads another 10MB of content, as opposed to a 300kb pure HTML/CSS/JS page? Hope so&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Stefan</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54225</link>
		<dc:creator>Stefan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 05:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54225</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t want to say that I wrote about this issue in any of the discussions at ALA before, but it seems like not everyone in the community wanted to believe that both loading times and website size still matter. In fact it looks like you all have forgotten where we come from. And there are still some people (nations) left. While we have been very strict with browser compatibility in the past, our behavior in kinds of download speed have been very generous.

But now we shouldn&#039;t forget everything we&#039;ve been used to in the past 2-5 years. Styling a website for a better, a living experience of the web is still necessary. Using all damn gimmicks like some did in the late 90&#039;s isn&#039;t in any way helpful for evolving the web.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t want to say that I wrote about this issue in any of the discussions at ALA before, but it seems like not everyone in the community wanted to believe that both loading times and website size still matter. In fact it looks like you all have forgotten where we come from. And there are still some people (nations) left. While we have been very strict with browser compatibility in the past, our behavior in kinds of download speed have been very generous.</p>
<p>But now we shouldn&#8217;t forget everything we&#8217;ve been used to in the past 2-5 years. Styling a website for a better, a living experience of the web is still necessary. Using all damn gimmicks like some did in the late 90&#8242;s isn&#8217;t in any way helpful for evolving the web.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Peacock</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54224</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Peacock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 03:59:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54224</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m in agreement that we&#039;ve gotten &quot;fat&quot;. I often have to argue about requested designs or features being too large on sites I&#039;m to design and build only to hear that &quot;it doesn&#039;t matter anymore&quot; from folks who have no clue about bandwidth in the first place.

It&#039;s simple - mobile web use is up and growing while mobile networks are notoriously saturated (iPhone especially). Small lean web sites are now in demand again for this reason, even if you&#039;re pushing separate mobile versions from your &quot;desktop&quot; pages.

Faster is always better with any web page and often the optimizations pay off in reduced hosting costs and hopefully easier to edit source.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m in agreement that we&#8217;ve gotten &#8220;fat&#8221;. I often have to argue about requested designs or features being too large on sites I&#8217;m to design and build only to hear that &#8220;it doesn&#8217;t matter anymore&#8221; from folks who have no clue about bandwidth in the first place.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s simple &#8211; mobile web use is up and growing while mobile networks are notoriously saturated (iPhone especially). Small lean web sites are now in demand again for this reason, even if you&#8217;re pushing separate mobile versions from your &#8220;desktop&#8221; pages.</p>
<p>Faster is always better with any web page and often the optimizations pay off in reduced hosting costs and hopefully easier to edit source.</p>
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		<title>By: Vaughan Magnusson</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2010/04/11/of-google-and-page-speed/#comment-54223</link>
		<dc:creator>Vaughan Magnusson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 03:02:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/?p=4492#comment-54223</guid>
		<description>Jeff, I can appreciate your point, a painfully slow page is unquestionably unpleasant to the user and should be discouraged.

The point I&#039;m making however, is that say for example flowers and gentle waterfall sounds in the page background gave better readings for blood pressure or perceived credibility - should this be taken into account when ranking results? Clearly no, and while this is ridiculous example, the same reasoning is at play.

I suppose my question is, that if a user responds more favourably to a certain operating environment, is this more important than the accuracy of the result? Googles move would indicate that they believe this &quot;operating environment&quot; further refines the accuracy of the result - but I&#039;m not so sure.

Also I&#039;m with you on that one Ron, there are other more commercial interests that could be at play here with Google, surely data/bandwidth is a very real factor in their bottom line.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff, I can appreciate your point, a painfully slow page is unquestionably unpleasant to the user and should be discouraged.</p>
<p>The point I&#8217;m making however, is that say for example flowers and gentle waterfall sounds in the page background gave better readings for blood pressure or perceived credibility &#8211; should this be taken into account when ranking results? Clearly no, and while this is ridiculous example, the same reasoning is at play.</p>
<p>I suppose my question is, that if a user responds more favourably to a certain operating environment, is this more important than the accuracy of the result? Googles move would indicate that they believe this &#8220;operating environment&#8221; further refines the accuracy of the result &#8211; but I&#8217;m not so sure.</p>
<p>Also I&#8217;m with you on that one Ron, there are other more commercial interests that could be at play here with Google, surely data/bandwidth is a very real factor in their bottom line.</p>
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