Comments on: A new answer to the IE6 question? http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/ Web design news and insights since 1995 Fri, 19 Mar 2010 14:24:28 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Walls Come Tumbling Down presentation slides and transcript | Stuff and Nonsense http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-51204 Walls Come Tumbling Down presentation slides and transcript | Stuff and Nonsense Fri, 25 Dec 2009 03:12:19 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-51204 <!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] Instead I provide simple but effectively designed HTML elements. This means great typography for headings, paragraphs, quotations, lists, tables and forms and no styling of layout. I think that Universal Internet Explorer 6 CSS pushes all the right buttons as a concept, but I know that it won't be appropriate in every situation. That's for you and your clients to judge. As Jeffrey Zeldman wrote in response: [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--> [...] Instead I provide simple but effectively designed HTML elements. This means great typography for headings, paragraphs, quotations, lists, tables and forms and no styling of layout. I think that Universal Internet Explorer 6 CSS pushes all the right buttons as a concept, but I know that it won't be appropriate in every situation. That's for you and your clients to judge. As Jeffrey Zeldman wrote in response: [...]

]]> By: Universal Internet Explorer 6 CSS | For A Beautiful Web http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-43815 Universal Internet Explorer 6 CSS | For A Beautiful Web Wed, 01 Jul 2009 20:00:01 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-43815 <!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] As Jeffrey rightly pointed out in his commentary, “ No hammer fits all nails, and no solution, however elegant, will work for every situation. But [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--> [...] As Jeffrey rightly pointed out in his commentary, “ No hammer fits all nails, and no solution, however elegant, will work for every situation. But [...]

]]> By: Internet Explorer 6 compatibility « Brad Bice – professional portfolio, projects and examples http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-43530 Internet Explorer 6 compatibility « Brad Bice – professional portfolio, projects and examples Thu, 18 Jun 2009 20:46:40 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-43530 [...] Jeffrey Zeldman said when referring to Clarke’s method, “no solution, however elegant, will work for every situation.” But work like this will [...] [...] Jeffrey Zeldman said when referring to Clarke’s method, “no solution, however elegant, will work for every situation.” But work like this will [...]

]]> By: New Javascript Tool Takes Aim At Web-Site Readability http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-43147 New Javascript Tool Takes Aim At Web-Site Readability Mon, 08 Jun 2009 22:38:44 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-43147 [...] “Readability”. Recently, on web-standards guru Jeffrey Zeldman’s blog there was a post which mentions briefly, in passing, “Arc90’s awesome Readability plug-in”. A [...] [...] “Readability”. Recently, on web-standards guru Jeffrey Zeldman’s blog there was a post which mentions briefly, in passing, “Arc90’s awesome Readability plug-in”. A [...]

]]> By: Thunderlizard Digest http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42895 Thunderlizard Digest Tue, 02 Jun 2009 21:43:26 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42895 <!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] of people are still using older browsers, including Internet Explorer 6. The great Jeffrey Zeldman writes about Andy Clarke's cool solution to dealing with CSS problems in IE6. At Web Design World, you can learn [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--> [...] of people are still using older browsers, including Internet Explorer 6. The great Jeffrey Zeldman writes about Andy Clarke’s cool solution to dealing with CSS problems in IE6. At Web Design World, you can learn [...]

]]> By: keronsen's Bookmarks on Delicious http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42841 keronsen's Bookmarks on Delicious Mon, 01 Jun 2009 11:23:24 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42841 <!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] Jeffrey Zeldman Presents : A new answer to the IE6 question? SAVE [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--> [...] Jeffrey Zeldman Presents : A new answer to the IE6 question? SAVE [...]

]]> By: Universal IE6 CSS and memories of NS4 - MeganMcDermott.com http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42827 Universal IE6 CSS and memories of NS4 - MeganMcDermott.com Sat, 30 May 2009 03:25:40 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42827 [...] as Zeldman notes: No hammer fits all nails, and no solution, however elegant, will work for every situation. [...] [...] as Zeldman notes: No hammer fits all nails, and no solution, however elegant, will work for every situation. [...]

]]> By: Brent Friar http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42826 Brent Friar Sat, 30 May 2009 00:51:48 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42826 As much as I hate IE6 and as often as I threaten to drop support, I still find myself putting in the fixes. Seriously, how hard is it to serve up a small CSS file wilh the necessary hacks to fix the design enough to make is passable in IE6? I rarely have more than a dozen lines of CSS is that in the IE6 only file. All of the IE6 CSS bugs and fixes are well documented. Not implementing them is just lazy. As much as I hate IE6 and as often as I threaten to drop support, I still find myself putting in the fixes. Seriously, how hard is it to serve up a small CSS file wilh the necessary hacks to fix the design enough to make is passable in IE6? I rarely have more than a dozen lines of CSS is that in the IE6 only file.

All of the IE6 CSS bugs and fixes are well documented. Not implementing them is just lazy.

]]> By: Carlos Eduardo http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42819 Carlos Eduardo Fri, 29 May 2009 13:29:56 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42819 It's a good approach, but I think it cannot resolve our problems with IE6. We can consider it like "graceful degradation" ? After working some years with so many clients I know that we can't ignore IE6, 'cause most of their clients are using IE (at least IE6) and we can't deliver something that doesn't fills their expectation about layout, no matter what browser are you using. So this is a good choice to use it in a personal site, but when you are working for clients, you can't ignore so many users that uses IE6 yet... Sadly... It’s a good approach, but I think it cannot resolve our problems with IE6. We can consider it like “graceful degradation” ?

After working some years with so many clients I know that we can’t ignore IE6, ’cause most of their clients are using IE (at least IE6) and we can’t deliver something that doesn’t fills their expectation about layout, no matter what browser are you using.

So this is a good choice to use it in a personal site, but when you are working for clients, you can’t ignore so many users that uses IE6 yet… Sadly…

]]> By: Stevie D http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42788 Stevie D Thu, 28 May 2009 11:55:05 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42788 <blockquote>If you tell a client it costs $X more for the site to work in IE6, and they still want it, fine, extra money for the extra time. But I find that often this leads to them jumping on board the death to IE6 campaign.</blockquote> That's all very well, but do you explain that by doing that, they are writing off about 15% of potential customers from the word go? <blockquote>Anyway, I think that ie 6 will die quite soon, not because of ie8, but because companies that still run win 2000 or even nt might drop theses OSes for Seven.</blockquote> I'd like to think so, but I work for a company running 2000 and I don't see it happening in the next year at least :-( <blockquote>Also, imagine someone sees a webpage at a friend’s. He opens his ie6 at home and gets a different page. Initial reaction: wrong url.</blockquote> You could easily modify the CSS to include <em>some</em> level of site branding, eg a logo and colour. You could also put a box at the top: "Not the page you were expecting? You're on the right website, but it's displayed differently because you're using an old browser. <a href="#" rel="nofollow">Find out more...</a>" kind of thing. Not an obtrusive thing, just an info box to help people understand they are in the right place and why they aren't getting quite the full experience.

If you tell a client it costs $X more for the site to work in IE6, and they still want it, fine, extra money for the extra time. But I find that often this leads to them jumping on board the death to IE6 campaign.

That’s all very well, but do you explain that by doing that, they are writing off about 15% of potential customers from the word go?

Anyway, I think that ie 6 will die quite soon, not because of ie8, but because companies that still run win 2000 or even nt might drop theses OSes for Seven.

I’d like to think so, but I work for a company running 2000 and I don’t see it happening in the next year at least :-(

Also, imagine someone sees a webpage at a friend’s. He opens his ie6 at home and gets a different page. Initial reaction: wrong url.

You could easily modify the CSS to include some level of site branding, eg a logo and colour. You could also put a box at the top: “Not the page you were expecting? You’re on the right website, but it’s displayed differently because you’re using an old browser. Find out more…” kind of thing. Not an obtrusive thing, just an info box to help people understand they are in the right place and why they aren’t getting quite the full experience.

]]> By: Ara Pehlivanian http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42752 Ara Pehlivanian Tue, 26 May 2009 15:44:06 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42752 P.S.: A quick look at the ie6 css file reveals some glaring problems when it comes to performance. Using expressions are a big no no as the browser recalculates values at every mousemove event, likewise the fact that no CSS hacks are being used means the file will likely be loaded via conditional comments, yet another HTTP request. It's nice in theory, but again, way too much bending over backwards for a backwards browser. P.S.: A quick look at the ie6 css file reveals some glaring problems when it comes to performance. Using expressions are a big no no as the browser recalculates values at every mousemove event, likewise the fact that no CSS hacks are being used means the file will likely be loaded via conditional comments, yet another HTTP request. It’s nice in theory, but again, way too much bending over backwards for a backwards browser.

]]> By: Ara Pehlivanian http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42750 Ara Pehlivanian Tue, 26 May 2009 15:39:56 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42750 Meh. I'm through bending over backwards for an 8 year old browser that's two versions behind. People need to start feeling the pain of navigating the web with that kludge and go upgrade. If it's IT departments, then their users need to start complaining. Enough with IE6. Meh. I’m through bending over backwards for an 8 year old browser that’s two versions behind. People need to start feeling the pain of navigating the web with that kludge and go upgrade. If it’s IT departments, then their users need to start complaining. Enough with IE6.

]]> By: Maaike http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42724 Maaike Mon, 25 May 2009 11:16:36 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42724 I totally agree with <a href="http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42611" rel="nofollow">Niels</a>. It doesn't rock, it's bad usability. I think progressive enhancement is the best way to go. I totally agree with Niels. It doesn’t rock, it’s bad usability. I think progressive enhancement is the best way to go.

]]> By: New Javascript Tool Takes Aim At Web-Site Readability « ReadableWeb http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42717 New Javascript Tool Takes Aim At Web-Site Readability « ReadableWeb Mon, 25 May 2009 00:16:41 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42717 [...] “Readability”. Recently, on web-standards guru Jeffrey Zeldman’s blog there was a post which mentions briefly, in passing, “Arc90’s awesome Readability plug-in”. A [...] [...] “Readability”. Recently, on web-standards guru Jeffrey Zeldman’s blog there was a post which mentions briefly, in passing, “Arc90’s awesome Readability plug-in”. A [...]

]]> By: Richard Fink http://www.zeldman.com/2009/05/21/a-new-answer-to-the-ie6-question/#comment-42697 Richard Fink Sun, 24 May 2009 08:15:34 +0000 http://www.zeldman.com/?p=1140#comment-42697 Does not rock. Premature, but bookmarked. Does not rock. Premature, but bookmarked.

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