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	<title>Comments on: The no-access road</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/</link>
	<description>Web design news and insights since 1995</description>
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		<title>By: Web Design Blog: Web Design &#38; Innovation in web standards : Viget Labs</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-44102</link>
		<dc:creator>Web Design Blog: Web Design &#38; Innovation in web standards : Viget Labs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 15:49:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-44102</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] January of 2008 Jeffery Zeldman wrote a post that really changed the way I thought about the web. The article talked about a disabled woman in a motorized scooter and how she had a difficult time [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] January of 2008 Jeffery Zeldman wrote a post that really changed the way I thought about the web. The article talked about a disabled woman in a motorized scooter and how she had a difficult time [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Nathan</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-32112</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 04:04:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-32112</guid>
		<description>In response to Doug&#039;s idea, you can create personalized Google maps here:
http://maps.google.com/help/maps/mymaps/create.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Doug&#8217;s idea, you can create personalized Google maps here:<br />
<a href="http://maps.google.com/help/maps/mymaps/create.html">http://maps.google.com/help/maps/mymaps/create.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Majko</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-31774</link>
		<dc:creator>Majko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 00:45:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-31774</guid>
		<description>I come from Slovakia (Eastern Europe - former comunistic bloc). And in Bratislava (the city I live in and the capital city of my country in the same time) there have been lots of inaccessible public places and buildings in the past but over the past several years since the Velvet Revolution (in 1989 when the comunistic regime fell), many things have changed towards better conditions including accessibility and the modern buildings being built nowadays are fully accessible.

In my practice I also focus on the Web Content Accessibility in my web projects I work on as a web coder from time to time in addition to studying at a college and also working full-time as a cashier in a supermarket.

The reason why my aim is to contribute to creating accessible web sites is also because I myself am a handicapped person having one eye blind so I know what&#039;s it like to be discriminated just because of having a dissability.
And that&#039;s why I&#039;m involved in an initiative in my country to teach other coders to create accessible web sites.

I am so glad for the work that has been done in this to improve web content accessibility but we still are not at the end. There&#039;s still a lot to do about it.

Can you agree with me?

yours fidelis from Slovakia</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I come from Slovakia (Eastern Europe &#8211; former comunistic bloc). And in Bratislava (the city I live in and the capital city of my country in the same time) there have been lots of inaccessible public places and buildings in the past but over the past several years since the Velvet Revolution (in 1989 when the comunistic regime fell), many things have changed towards better conditions including accessibility and the modern buildings being built nowadays are fully accessible.</p>
<p>In my practice I also focus on the Web Content Accessibility in my web projects I work on as a web coder from time to time in addition to studying at a college and also working full-time as a cashier in a supermarket.</p>
<p>The reason why my aim is to contribute to creating accessible web sites is also because I myself am a handicapped person having one eye blind so I know what&#8217;s it like to be discriminated just because of having a dissability.<br />
And that&#8217;s why I&#8217;m involved in an initiative in my country to teach other coders to create accessible web sites.</p>
<p>I am so glad for the work that has been done in this to improve web content accessibility but we still are not at the end. There&#8217;s still a lot to do about it.</p>
<p>Can you agree with me?</p>
<p>yours fidelis from Slovakia</p>
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		<title>By: Richard McLaughlin</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-30398</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard McLaughlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:24:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-30398</guid>
		<description>I am a disable vet, busted up my shoulder and had a bunch or operations. When I went to a hospital in a body brace that covered my upper body in plastic and iron bars I had to walk through the security thing at the front door. First, I had a hard time finding an angle to walk through - then the idiot at the door asked me to take off the brace so the alarm would not sound as I walked through the door.

Sad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a disable vet, busted up my shoulder and had a bunch or operations. When I went to a hospital in a body brace that covered my upper body in plastic and iron bars I had to walk through the security thing at the front door. First, I had a hard time finding an angle to walk through &#8211; then the idiot at the door asked me to take off the brace so the alarm would not sound as I walked through the door.</p>
<p>Sad.</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29280</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2008 22:59:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29280</guid>
		<description>Another link to share, sort of going in the direction that has been discussed in the comments. http://nyc.everyblock.com/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another link to share, sort of going in the direction that has been discussed in the comments. <a href="http://nyc.everyblock.com/">http://nyc.everyblock.com/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29040</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 20:40:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29040</guid>
		<description>@Renata - episode 110 of This American Life talks about that topic. http://www.thislife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?sched=824 

I feel that the only reason one person should sue for an incident like you describe is to get some sort of dignity back and help them come to realize that it wasn&#039;t their fault they tripped, it must be something or someone else&#039;s.... sarcasm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Renata &#8211; episode 110 of This American Life talks about that topic. <a href="http://www.thislife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?sched=824">http://www.thislife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?sched=824</a> </p>
<p>I feel that the only reason one person should sue for an incident like you describe is to get some sort of dignity back and help them come to realize that it wasn&#8217;t their fault they tripped, it must be something or someone else&#8217;s&#8230;. sarcasm.</p>
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		<title>By: Mala Erwin</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29012</link>
		<dc:creator>Mala Erwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:28:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29012</guid>
		<description>For anyone considering building a site as Doug suggests,  a good place to start might be &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.fixmystreet.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;FixMyStreet.com&lt;/a&gt;, which gives away its &lt;a href=&quot;https://secure.mysociety.org/cvstrac/dir?d=mysociety&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;source code&lt;/a&gt;. Sadly it&#039;s beyond my skills (I&#039;m a designer, not a developer), though I&#039;d be happy to help to the extent of my abilities -- follow URL for contact email.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For anyone considering building a site as Doug suggests,  a good place to start might be <a href="http://www.fixmystreet.com/" rel="nofollow">FixMyStreet.com</a>, which gives away its <a href="https://secure.mysociety.org/cvstrac/dir?d=mysociety" rel="nofollow">source code</a>. Sadly it&#8217;s beyond my skills (I&#8217;m a designer, not a developer), though I&#8217;d be happy to help to the extent of my abilities &#8212; follow URL for contact email.</p>
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		<title>By: Renata</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29002</link>
		<dc:creator>Renata</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 14:26:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-29002</guid>
		<description>In NYC, if you trip on a pothole or sidewalk that belongs to the City of New York, you may sue and you may even win, if you find that the City had been notified of the problem and did not fix it in the given amount of time (and I just don&#039;t remember what that is).  

Not directly related, but thought I&#039;d share :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In NYC, if you trip on a pothole or sidewalk that belongs to the City of New York, you may sue and you may even win, if you find that the City had been notified of the problem and did not fix it in the given amount of time (and I just don&#8217;t remember what that is).  </p>
<p>Not directly related, but thought I&#8217;d share :)</p>
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		<title>By: Bert</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28974</link>
		<dc:creator>Bert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 04:27:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28974</guid>
		<description>This is quite eye-opening, especially since I have never really experienced it.

And I agree that a consumerist.com type site for public services and facilities and the like is a great idea.

But my main take away from this post is that I need to stop and help strangers more. I tend to isolate myself from my surroundings, but now I need to open my eyes and help strangers in need.

Thanks for letting me see that!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is quite eye-opening, especially since I have never really experienced it.</p>
<p>And I agree that a consumerist.com type site for public services and facilities and the like is a great idea.</p>
<p>But my main take away from this post is that I need to stop and help strangers more. I tend to isolate myself from my surroundings, but now I need to open my eyes and help strangers in need.</p>
<p>Thanks for letting me see that!</p>
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		<title>By: Jeffrey Zeldman</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28940</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeffrey Zeldman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 01:34:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28940</guid>
		<description>James, thanks for sharing. Even when ramps exist and even when they aren&#039;t problematic to navigate, people who don&#039;t need to use ramps always seem to block them. It&#039;s amazing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>James, thanks for sharing. Even when ramps exist and even when they aren&#8217;t problematic to navigate, people who don&#8217;t need to use ramps always seem to block them. It&#8217;s amazing.</p>
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		<title>By: phil</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28938</link>
		<dc:creator>phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 23:13:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28938</guid>
		<description>&quot;http://www.fillthathole.org.uk/ seems like a good start.&quot;

&quot;Great lead, Ed.&quot;

Indeed.   And how very English.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;http://www.fillthathole.org.uk/ seems like a good start.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Great lead, Ed.&#8221;</p>
<p>Indeed.   And how very English.</p>
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		<title>By: James</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28904</link>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 16:10:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28904</guid>
		<description>Nice topic. Good on you for helping out. This subject is near and dear--I&#039;ve used a wheelchair since I broke my neck in an accident in 1999, and without a companion, I won&#039;t go out and about most places for fear of getting stuck in a situation like you described. So, I&#039;m always glad when there are people like you around who are willing to give a push, pull a door, etc. :)

I haven&#039;t been abroad, but I&#039;ve traveled quite a bit in the USA--most big cities, and have learned how inaccessible most of them are. Some are better than others, and newer is usually better, but it is tough out there.

I could go on and on about this, but just considering the curb thing...It may surprise many to know that the majority of curbs that ARE cut are still not easy to use for manual chair users like me, as there is almost always an obstacle (ramp too steep, has a threshold, not maintained--holes, uneven pavement, or my favorite, people standing in it). I almost got hit by a cab when visiting NYC, because I could not get enough momentum to get up the curb cutout due to people standing in it. I didn&#039;t want to hit them with my chair, so I was stuck in the street shouting &quot;watch out!&quot; when the light changed.

Unfortunately, I think most a people (God bless &#039;em) are clueless about this kind of stuff until they experience it, so it just isn&#039;t a priority. I spent 27 years never realizing any of it, then bam!, I couldn&#039;t go anywhere. I just never knew it was a problem before!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice topic. Good on you for helping out. This subject is near and dear&#8211;I&#8217;ve used a wheelchair since I broke my neck in an accident in 1999, and without a companion, I won&#8217;t go out and about most places for fear of getting stuck in a situation like you described. So, I&#8217;m always glad when there are people like you around who are willing to give a push, pull a door, etc. :)</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t been abroad, but I&#8217;ve traveled quite a bit in the USA&#8211;most big cities, and have learned how inaccessible most of them are. Some are better than others, and newer is usually better, but it is tough out there.</p>
<p>I could go on and on about this, but just considering the curb thing&#8230;It may surprise many to know that the majority of curbs that ARE cut are still not easy to use for manual chair users like me, as there is almost always an obstacle (ramp too steep, has a threshold, not maintained&#8211;holes, uneven pavement, or my favorite, people standing in it). I almost got hit by a cab when visiting NYC, because I could not get enough momentum to get up the curb cutout due to people standing in it. I didn&#8217;t want to hit them with my chair, so I was stuck in the street shouting &#8220;watch out!&#8221; when the light changed.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, I think most a people (God bless &#8216;em) are clueless about this kind of stuff until they experience it, so it just isn&#8217;t a priority. I spent 27 years never realizing any of it, then bam!, I couldn&#8217;t go anywhere. I just never knew it was a problem before!</p>
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		<title>By: Jeffrey Zeldman</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28722</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeffrey Zeldman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:03:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28722</guid>
		<description>Ben, beautifully said and profoundly true.

Shane, sorry to offend. I was thinking of the &quot;mustn&#039;t grumble&quot; aspect of British life, which can extend beyond the self. People in Britain are tough. They can tolerate all kinds of discomfort and frustration, not to mention train and other service outages, without complaining. (The same is true of New Yorkers.)

I have no doubt that that shopkeeper would have leaped to his feet to help if my wife and I had lost our footing on the bridge, or if our baby had been in any jeopardy.

I think he watched us struggle for a few days before he decided we were okay and worth cluing in about the lift. 

And I&#039;m sure he didn&#039;t know the lift was out of service.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ben, beautifully said and profoundly true.</p>
<p>Shane, sorry to offend. I was thinking of the &#8220;mustn&#8217;t grumble&#8221; aspect of British life, which can extend beyond the self. People in Britain are tough. They can tolerate all kinds of discomfort and frustration, not to mention train and other service outages, without complaining. (The same is true of New Yorkers.)</p>
<p>I have no doubt that that shopkeeper would have leaped to his feet to help if my wife and I had lost our footing on the bridge, or if our baby had been in any jeopardy.</p>
<p>I think he watched us struggle for a few days before he decided we were okay and worth cluing in about the lift. </p>
<p>And I&#8217;m sure he didn&#8217;t know the lift was out of service.</p>
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		<title>By: Shane</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28715</link>
		<dc:creator>Shane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 13:27:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28715</guid>
		<description>Jeffrey said, &quot;It was very English, because he had watched us endure this misery for several days before saying anything to help.&quot;

I respond with a mixture of anger and disappointment - it&#039;s a shame that your experience of London left that impression of English people on your mind; an impression so strong that you feel justified in lumping some 50 million people in the disobliging category.

I&#039;m English and consider myself to be polite and helpful - and I know many people who are also English, also polite, and also helpful.

Had I been in New York, I may have been that man who helped that old lady.

Let&#039;s hope your next trip to the UK leaves you with a better impression - we&#039;re not all that bad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeffrey said, &#8220;It was very English, because he had watched us endure this misery for several days before saying anything to help.&#8221;</p>
<p>I respond with a mixture of anger and disappointment &#8211; it&#8217;s a shame that your experience of London left that impression of English people on your mind; an impression so strong that you feel justified in lumping some 50 million people in the disobliging category.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m English and consider myself to be polite and helpful &#8211; and I know many people who are also English, also polite, and also helpful.</p>
<p>Had I been in New York, I may have been that man who helped that old lady.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s hope your next trip to the UK leaves you with a better impression &#8211; we&#8217;re not all that bad.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Buchanan</title>
		<link>http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28695</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Buchanan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 08:03:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zeldman.com/2008/01/18/no-access-lane/#comment-28695</guid>
		<description>Last year my fiancee broke her foot falling over a bad piece of footpath (no, we didn&#039;t sue; we&#039;re Australians ;P).

We had to do Christmas Shopping with her in a wheelchair because she simply couldn&#039;t last that long on crutches. Our local shopping centres have loaner wheelchairs which is awesome, but the experience was quite an eye-opener.

People don&#039;t get out of the way of wheelchairs, in fact many people stupidly step right in front while you&#039;re in motion; many shops have areas too small or cluttered to get around; one department store was using the accessible changeroom as storage and had to shuffle things around so she could get in there; disabled toilets had broken door open/close mechanisms; and so on. 

When you need these things, you suddenly realise that accessibility really really needs to be 100%. Not 50%, or 90%, not even 99%. Because that 1% can get you killed, if it&#039;s a missing curb ramp.

We&#039;re not an enlightened society just yet. We still marginalise disabled people, in ways that are even more disappointing for being mundane (after all, who needs a bit of dignity while you go to the toilet? oh wait, all of us).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Last year my fiancee broke her foot falling over a bad piece of footpath (no, we didn&#8217;t sue; we&#8217;re Australians ;P).</p>
<p>We had to do Christmas Shopping with her in a wheelchair because she simply couldn&#8217;t last that long on crutches. Our local shopping centres have loaner wheelchairs which is awesome, but the experience was quite an eye-opener.</p>
<p>People don&#8217;t get out of the way of wheelchairs, in fact many people stupidly step right in front while you&#8217;re in motion; many shops have areas too small or cluttered to get around; one department store was using the accessible changeroom as storage and had to shuffle things around so she could get in there; disabled toilets had broken door open/close mechanisms; and so on. </p>
<p>When you need these things, you suddenly realise that accessibility really really needs to be 100%. Not 50%, or 90%, not even 99%. Because that 1% can get you killed, if it&#8217;s a missing curb ramp.</p>
<p>We&#8217;re not an enlightened society just yet. We still marginalise disabled people, in ways that are even more disappointing for being mundane (after all, who needs a bit of dignity while you go to the toilet? oh wait, all of us).</p>
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